In-depth character discussion: Axel (3 versions)

[Don Vecta]

So yeah, by popular demand, I decided to play with Axel and trying to make a deep analysis about him. I know several community members are fond of him and I'm sure this thread will bring a lot of light to the ones who want to play hardcore with him.

I'll try to cover up all the three versions of him and post stuff related to them by post. Right now I'm starting with SOR1 Axel.

Movelist of SOR1 Axel (taken from the character movelist).

Axel Stone.

Normal attacks.

Rush combo - B B B B (SOR1 two long jabs, gut punch, mid roundhouse kick great range).
Back attack - B + C (SOR1 Forearm punch)
Special - A (SOR1 spinning dragon smash)
Special 2 - forward + A (SOR1 performs a 3-hit punch combo)

Jumping attacks.

Vertical jump attack - C then B (SOR1 does a side knee kick, knocks down)
Jump attack - forward + C then B (SOR1 Axel launches with a front knee attack, short range, knocks down.)
Diving attack - C then down + B (SOR1 dives with his two knees in an awkward sexy (lol) pose, doesn't knock down and leaves enemy open to combo or grab).

Running attacks.

Blitz (0 - 1 star) - forward forward + B Grand upper (Axel dashes and hits the enemies repeatedly with an ascending uppercut).
Blitz 2 (2 stars) - forward forward + B Spinning punch attack (lounges forward in an ascending/descending pattern spinning while punching).
Blitz 3 (3 stars) - forward forward + B Spinning grand upper (dashes in the same ascending/descending pattern, spin punch ending in uppercut).

Grab attacks (get close to an enemy).

Vault over opponent - Grab then C, you can switch from grabbing in front or from behind.
One-hit frontal knockdown - Grab then B (does a nasty headbutt)
Rush attack - Grab, hold forward + B B B (SOR1 knee bashes the opponent in the first two hits, then performs a third knee attack and finishes with an uppercut)
Backwards throw - Grab, hold backwards B (SOR1 performs a neck throw).
Grab from behind - Hold from behind or vault opponent if grabbing in front then B (SOR1 performs a German Suplex).

Weapon special attacks.

Pipe/Bat/Plank - forward forward + B (SOR1 runs and swings it to the opponent)
Sword/Katana - forward forward + B (SOR1 runs and performs an double slash attack)
Sword/Katana A attack - forward + A (remains in a stance blinking then unleashes a high range swipe, all in full invincibility)


Overview.

SOR1 Axel was modeled back in the day to be the perfect balanced character regarding speed, technique, damage and stamina. After SOR2, the balanced model was replaced by Blaze while the speedy character became Sammy, thus Axel in SOR2 became slightly more powerful and less speedy (kinda like Adam in SOR1).

SOR1 Axel has several advantages at his favor that I personally prefer him over the rest of the versions:

1) Faster. His moves are fast enough to perform well, same for his walking and running movement. His rush combo input it's fast enough to link several combos inside of it, thus, capable to pull out good damage.

2) Reach in ground moves. This is one of the departments that SOR2 and SOR3 Axels lack but SOR1 Axel doesn't. His reach it's not as long as Zan's or Rudra but it's competent enough to keep enemies at bay.

3) Good melee weapon handling. Pipe swing it's quick and has reach. Pipe special allows a very good end swipe that knocks down enemies approaching from behind. Knife and bottle reach is decent, not as good as it used to be the original SOR1 Axel but a lot better than the other 2 versions. Sword it's quite good even though has short lange but has godly speed and it's running special it's fine as well, pretty damaging.

4) Great comboability (yes, I made up that word). It's very easy to link up his rush combo into his 1-star blitz (IMHO, pretty strong) or his 3-hit combo forward special (which also is VERY damaging). Even though his natural damage input it's a lot weaker than the other versions, with a well placed combo he can chunk out 70% to 75% off from a standard full lifebar.


How to play with SOR1 Axel.

1) Abuse Grand Uppah. Many people might argue if his 1-star Blitz it's weaker than SOR2 one but in my opinion, this version of Grand Upper it's as good as SOR2's. 5 to 6-hit attack, good to chip damage against blocking enemies, pulls out decent damage, comboable, reliable. Bit on the short range,. though but still quite safe to use and abuse.

2) Abuse his standard rush combo. Since his range it's quite good, it's easier to get a standard beat 'em up run by using the normal combo. However, it's better to combine it either with Grand Uppah or f A special.

3) Always stay on the move. His speed is quite decent and allows him to be always moving all over the screen. He's not as quick as Blaze/Rudra/Skate but you still can walk perfectly well and avoid enemies or catch their moves.


The run & grab tactic could work alright for him but it's not so effective since his grab damage it's kinda puny but could be added to the whole set if you want to add variety or keep enemies away.

Feel free to add mroe stuff, I'll be playing later SOR2 Axel and SOR3 Axel.

[kmc]

I like Axel-1 (simpler to call them like this?) as well. I've watched a hard solo run

apart of what you said, two other things:
1. Rear attack: a very quick move, can be mixed with jabs to handle enemies from both side. But the key is to anticipate, not to wait to be surrounded. My main is Rudra but her rear attack takes too long to finish.
2. Series: a one-hit move, long reach, very quick (this also makes the whole of his bbbb rush very quick). The most useful series I'm afraid. Axel-2&3 has a two-hit move, thus they can't poking around with this. Using rear and series, you can knock down them in less time and find a good place not to be crowded.

Also his back throw has long invisibility.

[realnabarl]

I will give 2 first.

1. Blow enemies high using Grand Upper: The last hit of Grand Upper could blow enemies high. Only BK3 Axel could hit enemies with his last hit of his Grand Upper every time.

To do with that
BK3 Axel = easiest
SoR1 Axel = hard
SoR2 Axel = Very hard

So if you are playing BK3 Axel, you could just spam Grand Upper to send enemies out of the SoR1 elevator.


2. Only SoR1 and SoR2 char can do this: Using offensive special while front grabbing.
Since Axel's grab move is not strong enough, this would be a good choice for SoR1 and SoR2 Axel.

[Don Vecta]

I was playing against my nightmare Abadede and I hit him with the Grand Uppah thinking he'd blow me off with his annoying BLEAAAAAAARGH~!, but oddly enough, he ate all the hits of it, I kept spamming it expecting to be countered it but no, oddly enough he never broke my attack.

I also did that to the Kusano before SOR2 X route and he didn't break my Grand Uppah with his BLEARGH~! Quite weird (but cool), that made the fight against him quite easy..

[realnabarl]

I was playing against my nightmare Abadede and I hit him with the Grand Uppah thinking he'd blow me off with his annoying BLEAAAAAAARGH~!, but oddly enough, he ate all the hits of it, I kept spamming it expecting to be countered it but no, oddly enough he never broke my attack.

I also did that to the Kusano before SOR2 X route and he didn't break my Grand Uppah with his BLEARGH~! Quite weird (but cool), that made the fight against him quite easy..

Cause the hits connect very closely.

[BigDarsh]

I was playing against my nightmare Abadede and I hit him with the Grand Uppah thinking he'd blow me off with his annoying BLEAAAAAAARGH~!, but oddly enough, he ate all the hits of it, I kept spamming it expecting to be countered it but no, oddly enough he never broke my attack.

I also did that to the Kusano before SOR2 X route and he didn't break my Grand Uppah with his BLEARGH~! Quite weird (but cool), that made the fight against him quite easy..

At close range; the first hit can miss but the second hit always guaranteed the third hit, great weapon with invincibility startup.

There is something usefull with axel SoR2 (maybe with the others versions) is the hitstun of his jab (B) is huge and it permits to link manually the 2 stars move. (B,X,down,forward).

It's not usefull against a single opponent, but versus a group, it is great because, the recovery of the 2 stars is faster than the 0 star gran upper. On top of that, it goes through the opponent (so you can reach the ones that are in the back of the group) and it goes down too to reach people on lower Y axis.
To conclude, that move as rear attack status during the middle of the animation which permit to prevent backward opponent from approching while comboing (but beware of long range characters as whip girl or soozy in example).

Thank you for sharing.

[kmc]

I agree with BigDarsh about the 2star blitz usefulness. I find for many chars (for Axel, Blaze, Rudra, Elle, ...) 2star blitz is far better than 3star.

[Antares Zyklus]

Awesome info dudes. I had no idea Grand Upper could break through Abadede's counter. That'll certainly be useful on my next attempt at a Mania run with him (was using SOR2 Axel in my last attempt but and SOR1 Axel the previous attempt). Got VERY close to finishing it with SOR1 Axel, but lost at Stage 8 SOR1 route. Any tips on effectively taking out Shiva (Stage 7 SOR1 route) without being pwned? I ask because Shiva seems to beat out anything Axel can throw at him along with punishing him greatly. Aside from ninjas, Abadede, more than two whip girls, Neo-X, and Shiva I think I can get through everything else just fine. I'm not sure if you guys spam throw resets or not, but I do it often on foes with more than one life bar (almost impossible to do it on Shiva in Mania). Well, keep the info coming guys.

Something else to note:

I'm not sure if this is accurate for all Axels, but Stage 5 (SOR1 route) the Galsias all seems to jab Axel out of his sword attack animation. I take it Axel has no sort of frame invulnerability when attacking with sword?

[Don Vecta]

Playing with SOR2 Axel now. Here's some input.

Movelist.

Axel Stone SOR2 version.

Normal attacks.

Rush combo - B B B B (SOR2 two short jabs, cross and double side kick, short range)
Back attack - B + C (SOR2 back punch)
Special - A (spinning dragon smash)
Special 2 - forward + A (multi-combo punches)
Special 3 - forward forward + A (Tatsumaki kick)

Jumping attacks.

Vertical jump attack - C then B (knocks down, SOR2 does a jumping frontal kick)
Jump attack - forward + C then B (knocks down. SOR2 long jumping kick, long range)
Diving attack - C then down + B (dives with his two knees in an awkward sexy (lol) pose, doesn't knock down and leaves enemy open to combo or grab).

Running attacks.

Blitz (0 - 1 star) - forward forward + B Grand upper (Axel dashes and hits the enemies repeatedly with an ascending uppercut).
Blitz 2 (2 stars) - forward forward + B Spinning punch attack (lounges forward in an ascending/descending pattern spinning while punching).
Blitz 3 (3 stars) - forward forward + B Spinning grand upper (dashes in the same ascending/descending pattern, spin punch ending in uppercut).

Grab attacks (get close to an enemy).

Vault over opponent - Grab then C, you can switch from grabbing in front or from behind.
One-hit frontal knockdown - Grab then B (does a nasty headbutt)
Rush attack - Grab, hold forward + B B B (does the knee bashes ends up with a thrid and fourth knee attack)
Backwards throw - Grab, hold backwards B (does a backflip launch).
Grab from behind - Hold from behind or vault opponent if grabbing in front then B (does a backwards Bodyslam).

Weapon special attacks.

Pipe/Bat/Plank - forward forward + B (launches with the short end of the stick then swipes the rod away, hits enemies from behind)
Sword/Katana - forward forward + B (SOR2 performs a rising dragon punch with sword in hand)


Overview.

This Axel has a lot less range than SOR1 version and it's slightly slower in the movement and attack input. He's still good enough to make effective combos with his 1-star blitz and his specials. I find him harder to play with since his range it's not so big and certain enemies with mid range attacks can trump him easily (say Electras or some bosses like Barbon).

His Grand Uppah here hits only 3 times but it's still damaging (he's nowhere as strong as it used to be in SOR2, though), comboable and his only abusable move in his attacks. Due of his 3 hit attacks, sometimes it won't be so satisfying to knock off a bunch of assholes at the same time like I use to do with Axel-1 but it's still resourceful.

His jump game it's a lot better than Axel-1, has better reach and good start up jump (press C then B immediately as you take off) that can trump some anti-air assholes like Donnies or Barbons if done correctly.

Damage input it's slightly bigger but not for much, grab game it's more damaging but I find his back grab (backwards bodyslam) kinda unsafe since he does a small hop a-la Ash when he's done. Not sure if has invincibility frames on it but I feel it awkward.

His melee weapon it's okayish, with his strength lying on the pipe mostly (he does the Axel-1's sworn downwards swipe, very fast and very safe, bit short range but quick enough to recover quickly. His running special it's pretty good good since it hits from the run then the swipe knocks the opponent giving a painful 2-hit combo. With knife he's lame, super short range and nothing special on it. I suggest to throw a knife instead of using it.

His fA special it's great to finish off enemies who doesn't block. With blocking enemies it's REALLY unsafe since enemies tend to block AND move away from it and then you're very vulnerable for counter-attacking. I still prefer to use Axel-1's more.

Overall in find him less resourceful than Axel-1 but still fun to play with. Relies way too much on his blitzes 1 and 2. Probly someone else can give better points than me here.

Later on, going to play BK3 Axel.

[Don Vecta]

So, I finished another round in Mania with Axel-2. I can't say I really feel comfortable playing with him but it wasn't that bad. I still found Axel-1 a lot better and with more resources than Axel-2.

when I fought Yasha & Onihime, they trump me with their on rush combo (I couldn't do consistently the off-screen trick to keep them away with rush combos since they have lot better reach than mine. Was a bit troublesome.

His Grand Uppah it's not really that good. Abadede and Kusano kept breaking it, but if I hit them with the last frame of it, it knock them down for good damage.

I found a cool trick to whoop Bear's ass, though. Knock him down but don't stay too close, say around 3 characters away. If you're too close he'll go jab jab cross on your ass and if you are too far he'll ass-jump at you. He has to attempt to do his dashing upper and then you'll do your own dashing uppah and you'll trump his. Wash, rinse and repeat, he's toast with this trick.

I found Zamza a lot more troublesome too. Since Axel-2's reach it's shit, if you do a jab, he'll usually block and then grab you. The fucker did that to me like 5 times! Grab and run it's the way to go with this punk.

[Don Vecta]

And to finish the day, I played a mania run with BK3 Axel and finished it. Here's the stuff about him.


Axel Stone. BK3 version

Normal attacks.

Rush combo - B B B B (two short jabs, cross and double side kick, short range, VERY fast)
Back attack - B + C (back punch)
Special - A (spinning dragon smash)
Special 2 - forward + A (multi-hit combo)

Jumping attacks.

Vertical jump attack - C then B (does a jumping frontal kick)
Jump attack - forward + C then B (long jumping kick, long range, knocks down)
Diving attack - C then down + B (dives with his two knees in an awkward sexy (lol) pose, doesn't knock down and leaves enemy open to combo or grab).

Running attacks.

Blitz (0 - 1 star) - forward forward + B Grand upper (Axel dashes and hits the enemies repeatedly with an ascending uppercut).
Blitz 2 (2 stars) - forward forward + B Spinning punch attack (lounges forward in an ascending/descending pattern spinning while punching).
Blitz 3 (3 stars) - forward forward + B Spinning grand upper (dashes in the same ascending/descending pattern, spin punch ending in uppercut).

Grab attacks (get close to an enemy).

Vault over opponent - Grab then C, you can switch from grabbing in front or from behind.
One-hit frontal knockdown - Grab then B (does a nasty headbutt)
Rush attack - Grab, hold forward + B B B (does the knee bashes ends up with a third and fourth knee attack)
Backwards throw - Grab, hold backwards B (does a backflip launch).
Grab from behind - Hold from behind or vault opponent if grabbing in front then B (does a backwards Bodyslam).

Weapon special attacks.

Pipe/Bat/Plank - forward forward + B (launches with the short end of the stick then swipes the rod away, hits enemies from behind)
Sword/Katana - forward forward + B (performs a rising dragon punch with sword in hand)


Overview.

This Axel definitely departs completely from the other two for a very big different: He's VERY fast but also VERY weak! His movement speed it's as average as the others but his attacks are fairly lot faster, kinda as fast as BK3 Shiva, this allows him to recover quite quickly from attacks and keep the rushfest without a problem. His speed also allow him to pull out combos with ease.

However, all his damage input it's low, VERY low. I think even Blaze and Rudra does more damage. An Axel-1 or 2 would kill a beginner Galsia with his rush combo, Axel-3 doesn't. His B B B ffB combo would take around 35% of a full lifebar while his B B B fA combo would take 45% of a full lifebar at most. He definitely plays with the trope of the fast but weak type of character and requires tons of patience to win with him.

Another gripe I found was that his melee weapon handling it's SHIT. What the other two have as awesome, he has it as shitty. The pipe swing starts a lot slower (animation it's like Axel-1 but under the water) and takes like 3 frames to recover, same for the running attack. Damage it's the same as the others just simply crappy speed. Knife it's still shitty, standard sword it's quite slow too, but his running special still hits an enemy from behind while landing, which is pretty awesome.

He still has his good air game, good reach in his kick and trumps many attacks. However, his reach it's low, just like his SOR2 counterpart. Again, enemies with longer arms own him badly face to face.

His Grand Uppah it's quite different from the rest, this one has again like 6 to 7 hits on it and the super weaksauce uppercut launches the enemy upwards more (as someone mentioned above). And yes, playing with him in the SOR1 elevator it's lots of fun (excepting those annoying Haku-ohs that keep recovering in the air). You can own Abadede, Shiva or any enemy who loves to do specials to interrupt your attack without a problem... just that, at difference of Axel-1, it will take u forever to beat them.

All and all it's a dynamic character to play with but you need to be too patient since his damage it's pretty much like a schoolgirl with anemia. His weapon handling sucks, but if u don't use weapons then you'd be cool with that.


I think from all the three, Axel-1 it's the top of all of them. Has damage, speed, stamina, reach and technique.

[Punk Signal]

I think from all the three, Axel-1 it's the top of all of them. Has damage, speed, stamina, reach and technique.

Yes! And his jump kick is pure evil, a pity it is short ranged. I mean what's the point of jumping from that kind range when you can pull off a combo from the same distance.

Anyway you don't really need to jump with Axel-1 (except when facing those bloody "Rocketeers"). He's ground-based, and there's nothing more satisfying than a well-placed "Special 2 - forward + A". Now making those 3-hits to connect is another story. Any advice?

Note: Thanks for all those characters/movelist threads, Don Vecta. Very informative stuff! \o/

I like Axel-1 (simpler to call them like this?) as well.

Thank God I’m not the only one. I like Axel-1 a lot too:

- First he's got style. Nothing beats a sweaty guy with a sleeveless tee-shirt,

- His Grand Upper: Everytime Axel-1sparks that move I'm mesmerized. Not only his version makes more hits but he has a way of twisting his body with a corkscrew effect as if the Designer wanted to make us feel every inch of pain inflicted. Brilliant!

-I always take Axel-1 (& Max) when I'm out for blood...

[badjab]

- His Grand Upper: Everytime Axel-1sparks that move I'm mesmerized. Not only his version makes more hits but he has a way of twisting his body with a corkscrew effect as if the Designer wanted to make us feel every inch of pain inflicted. Brilliant!

That was a very clever use of Axel-2's tiger uppercut sprites from the Bare Knuckle II beta.

[Danzig]

I really like Axel 1... but I'm no good with him. I only managed to get to the fourth stage on Mania before losing a continue and having to whip out Zan and abuse his ridiculously cheap blitz. Still lost though.

[realnabarl]

More thoughts:

Axel-1's jumping kick has short range, it will be owned by kung-fu master's flying kick. But it's still reliable in some cases, using run + jump + attack to break out bad situation still works for him. However his vertical jumping kick is totally useless, with even less range, I don't know why is this thing even exist.
But luckily he has a useful series, he can protect himself by using this, cause in some cases we must fighting defensively.

Axel-1's star blitzes is slower but with more hits. With longer delay mode, he can 'involve' more people in it, these would cause more damage in some cases.

0 star blitz, needless to talk about it.
1 star blitz would be more useful than what people think of.
2 stars blitz is useful to handle those annoying fast punks, you can also break enemy's blocking by this.
3 stars blitz is stupid from BK3 ages.

There's some obvious AI flaws with Axel-2/3's Grand Upper, I have mentioned in another post, I will always recommend people playing or making playing videos with Axel-1.